| [Thread Prev] | [Thread Next] | [Thread Index] | [Date Prev] | [Date Next] | [Date Index] |
Maybe it would be helpful to write Wikipedia entries in multiple languages on this issue. I do not know how Wikipedia deals with languages other than English, but I hope that it is open to entries in any language. If this is possible, then the information would be in one place and on a site that is becoming more and more important as an authority on many topics. David David C. Kopaska-Merkel Geological Survey of Alabama P.O. Box 869999 Tuscaloosa AL 35486-6999 (205) 247-3695 (direct line/voice mail) (205) 349-2852 (switchboard) fax 349-2861 www.gsa.state.al.us To join sednet, an e-mail group for discussion of sedimentology, send a blank e-mail message to sednet-subscribe@yahoogroups.com. To join a new list about science education in Alabama, send a blank e-mail message to ALScienceEdNews-subscribe@yahoogroups.com. -----Original Message----- From: paleonet-owner@nhm.ac.uk [mailto:paleonet-owner@nhm.ac.uk] On Behalf Of Steeman, Fedor A.. Sent: Thursday, November 02, 2006 2:43 AM To: paleonet@nhm.ac.uk Cc: Jensen, Michael S. Subject: SV: paleonet European Creationism Dear Ken, Yes, I have also heard rumours about an uprise of creationism in Poland and now that it broke through with a minister involved is truely shocking! What I don't understand is how Catholics could be behind this push for "creation science". As far as I understood, Pope John Paul II issued a statement once that was in any case not dismissive of evolution. At most, modern Catholics would explore the "Intelligent Design" ideas a bit, but "creation science" with its belief in a recent creation in six days was mainly the territory of orthodox protestant fundamentalists and evangelists. This is far from a mainly American problem. It has been slumbering in Europe for years. In my country of origin, the Netherlands, evolution theory has been repeatedly been slipping in and out of school education depending on the political wind. We have a big Christian Democrat party dominated by Catholics. Recently, our minister of education, a Christian Democrat, also suggested to start a debate on evolution and intelligent design after a talk with a scientist supportive of ID. She was heavily criticized, though, and had to withdraw her comments. I myself have been continuously trying to assemble arguments against the creationist nonsense poured out all over the internet in my native language, Dutch, on a little website (www.daaromevolutie.net). I have too little spare time to spend on it, however, and would wish that people of the scientific communities in the Netherlands and Belgium would become more involved in this issue. More organisation is always good, but if there is no engagement, and too little interest, then we won't come very far. Maybe we should have a specific European website in multiple languages assembling arguments against creationist outpourings. A kind of equivalent of the Talk Origins website (www.talkorigins.org). I have been thinking a lot about this; A kind of (www.thereforeevolution.eu) or something... But with a day-job, evening school and a family I personally do not have much time on my hands. We need to work together! Cheers, Fedor -----Oprindelig meddelelse----- Fra: paleonet-owner@nhm.ac.uk [mailto:paleonet-owner@nhm.ac.uk] På vegne af N. MacLeod Sendt: 31. oktober 2006 08:33 Til: PaleoNet Emne: paleonet Polish Creationism This is posted for Ken Monsch <slmknsc@netscape.net> N. MacLeod ---------- Dear all, The following concerns a subject that is notoriously boring to some, but I hope it will still be of some interest: creationism. I reckon that the majority of subscribers are from the USA, where creationism and its pseudoscientific spin-off "Intelligent Design" are very well known. As far as I remember, it is said often enough on PaleoNet that this is mainly an American problem, that thank goodness hasn't got through to other parts of the world. I would like to stress, however, that this is clearly not the case. I do remember that a list member from Australia (do you remember who you are?) remarked that creationism is starting to make some waves over there, aided by American "experts". There is also an aggressive form of muslim creationism (see http://www.harunyahya.com/index.php) that manifests itself with muslim students also in Europe (reports are known from the Netherlands and Belgium, where students refused to accept teaching on evolution, and claimed boldly that Allah created earth literally with his hands). But I want to focus on a creationist movement in Poland, a country where I lived before not too long, that wants to make waves throughout the whole European Union. It has been known by some that professor Maciej Giertych, formerly of the Polish Academy of Sciences, was championing "creation science". Giertych himself is specialised in dendrology, plant physiology and genetics. He is also a MEP (Member of the European Parliament) for Poland, representing LPR, a conservative ultra-right-wing party with Roman Catholic roots, that is also in the Polish government since May this year. His son (Roman Giertych) is the Minister of Education in Poland (thankfully, he has no say in higher education or science policies). Earlier this month, M. Giertych organised a "public debate" on the teaching of evolution. Supported by the little-known scientists Joseph Mastropoalo (California State University), Hans Zillmer (University of Berlin) and Guy Berthault (Ecole Polytechnique de Paris), Giertych argued, that "creation science" should replace evolution in schools. I don't know if he meant schools in Poland, but since he's a MEP, I reckon he meant schools in the whole EU. The Polish Vice-Minister of Education, Miroslaw Orzechowski (also from LPR), argued in Polish newspapers a few days later, that evolution is a legalised lie, and that a lie must not be taught instead of the truth. The truth is, he said, creationism, which comes forth from faith (I don't agree!!), and has not been questioned for thousands (sic!) of generations. Creationists amongst politicians who make policies, who want to influence public opinion even in the whole of the EU, and are actively supported by scientists from the United States, that is what we see! What I mention here is but a fraction of what the Polish public could read and hear in the last few weeks. Many truly outrageous claims come from these creationists. Polish scientists unanimously condemn the words and actions of M. Giertych and the Ministry of Education. A summary of this news made "Nature", please check out: http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v443/n7114/full/443890c.html (or your paper issue: Nature 443, 890-891, 26 October 2006). I feel that what I described is really serious. What will these people do? How will this issue end? What will it imply for the future of our science? Please, let us not ignore creationism, to realise later that this movement makes policies that can destroy our science. Please let us not think that this is only a marginal American issue. Please let us educate the public. Phew! What do you on the list think of all this? Ken ************************************************************************* Dr. Kenneth A. Monsch Formerly of the University of Wroclaw, Poland New address details known shortly
Partial index: